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Our president, not many threads about him.

Discuss anything.

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Mighty Mouse
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by Mighty Mouse »

Just a little quote from Obama before the election:
"You know, Senator Clinton says that she's concerned about Social Security but is not willing to say how she would solve the Social Security crisis," Obama told the National Journal. "I think voters aren't going to feel real confident that this is a priority for her."
And a big one from another source:
Social security: Responding to the crisis
ISSA, 13.01.2010 | Feature

The financial and economic crisis has highlighted the centrality and strengths of social security systems, but also their potential weaknesses. Increasing unemployment has hurt contribution revenues and increased expenditure due to increased benefit demand. Yet many governments have seized on social security systems as a vital policy tool to counteract the social and economic impacts of the crisis and act as counter-cyclical automatic stabilizers. (1).

The financial and economic crisis that began in 2007 has delivered a tumultuous two years for the financial world, sending many financial institutions into a tailspin and putting governments in difficulty. As one might expect with such an extensive crisis, social security systems have also been affected, and social security funds have suffered. A large number of these schemes witnessed a sharp contraction of their asset portfolio values in 2008, affecting their long-term sustainability. Nevertheless, social security systems have responded effectively to the test by softening the impact of the crisis. The challenge for social security now is to continue to cope with rising unemployment and the burden of future debt.

The impact of the crisis on social security financing

In the longer term, the crisis may lead to a reassessment of the roles and scope of many national social security systems. In the shorter term, however, a challenge facing many systems has been one of maintaining financial equilibrium. A recent ISSA survey (2) of the impacts of the crisis on social security funds has revealed that many funds, especially in industrialized countries, have experienced a negative investment performance.

Many national pension systems have experienced substantial losses on the asset portfolio values. For example, the negative returns suffered by industrialized countries in 2008 ranged from -29.5 per cent to -3.2 per cent. But not all funds have suffered to the same degree. In some countries financial investment strategies have proven less risky and volatile. This is particularly so for strategies focused on domestic, fixed income securities, albeit that these may produce potentially lower average returns. A number of developing countries have faired quite well, with Mexico returning 7.46 per cent and Thailand 9.4 per cent in 2008.More recent data on the performance of pension funds seems to suggest that some funds in the industrialized countries have begun to recover with a number of funds posting positive returns in the 2nd quarter of 2009.

There are additional financial challenges facing social security in the short to medium term. Rising unemployment rates, reduced contributions, and surges in new claims for benefits have placed and continue to place social security systems under considerable strain, especially as unemployment continues to grow (3). For instance, increasing cash benefits or introducing new ones or freezing or reducing contribution rates for businesses, all of which may be considered useful mechanisms to boost consumer spending and support economic activity, may also lead to financial imbalances in social security programmes. These measures, as part of wider stimulus packages, will constitute a semi-permanent financial burden for social security. The risk for social security is one of increasing deficits, therefore limiting future capacity to pay adequate benefits in years to come.

Moreover, an additional medium-term risk is the high probability of a prolonged labour market recession. This is a very real possibility and according to the International Institute for Labour Studies, evidence from the experience of previous crises indicates that labour markets tend to recover only four to five years after an economic recovery has begun (4). This scenario spells continued labour market problems and serves to reaffirm once again the relevance of social security to compensate for labour market failure. Coupled with the additional burden of demographic ageing, all of these factors pose problems which have to be overcome by social security.

Nevertheless, the sharp contraction in the value of equities in industrialized countries – averaging a drop of 23 per cent in 2008 – and a dramatic policy-induced fall in interest rates have increased the financial insecurity of current and future retirees who expect to rely heavily on private pension plans for much of their retirement incomes. In response, some public pension schemes are now being asked to respond to political pressure for higher benefits, even as they too look to mounting financial challenges stemming from the crisis and population aging.
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LGM
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by LGM »

What's the point you're trying to make with that quote, MM?

Of course the economic impact of the contraction is felt by the Soc Sec system (just as it kicked the hell out of the state retirement system I pay into). One good reason to diversify the holdings of those systems. Relying on stock markets didn't work out so well.

Get the economy going again, get people working, raise the minimum age, and it's workable. I'm nearly 50. I bet I'll be one of the lucky ones who get to be first on having the age raised so I retire later.

Here's a little data from the 2009 Social Security System's Trustees report. '09 was not great, but not all that bad. You can go back and see previous year's reports, too. This is a short term projection, however.
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Long term-
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Things get interesting in 2037, about the time I turn 77. Income to SS will need to increase to be able to pay what they expect to need to pay. One of the echoes of the Baby Boom...

The problem needs to be solved. Sooner is good. We're hearing about the issue, but work needs doing. Maybe a logical next step for the current administration. Another option- do nothing about SS and work until you die. Historically it's the most common solution.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by Mighty Mouse »

I didn't have time for more detailed response to 44's questioning my characterizing SS as in crisis. Personally, I don't believe that something has to be dire. It just has to be under duress at critical juncture in time. With personal pensions having lost significant value, public system will face increasing stress unless something is done. Delaying by reducing benefits and extending the retirement age seem like stopgaps to me. It's kinda like putting the brass ring just a little further out of reach.

I also wanted to point out that Obama characterized it as crisis, not just me.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by get some »

LGM, great point about the contraction affecting social security. that was my first thought as i was starting to read the article.

MM, what exactly have the current brand of republicans done to elicit such confidence in their abilities to deal with these problems better than the democrats? what reasonable solutions have they brought to the table? i havent heard any. or maybe i just cant hear them over the incessent ranting about "baby killers", armageddon, socialism, and the comparisons being made between hitler and obama.

the democrats got serious and are making efforts to deal with the issues. you may not agree with them completely and they may prove to not be the best solutions in the end but what is our other option? i think people are getting tired of the hawks and fear mongering. i would be more than happy if the republicans stepped up and started getting serious about the problems we are facing. they could start by harshly denouncing the extremist elements within their ranks that are encouraging violent responses to legally enacted legislation. and then they can put a leash on their pet Sarah Palin, whom seems more than happy to take up the reigns of the previous administrations political philosophies whether she realizes what they are or not. did they not levy severe criticism towards Obama for being too much of a "Rock Star"? anyone wanna explain to me how Palin is anything but a media Paris Hilton? i'll wait for my answer after her "Reality" show begins airing.

(lol...typing wh.ore gets translated to Paris Hilton...thats just funny)

44, great points. makes me wonder how the costs of our 2 wars compare to the cost of the new healthcare bill compare. my guess is that paying for healthcare is a drop in the bucket compared to what we have already spent and will ultimately end up spending in Iraq. why is it ok to spend a fortune on war but its seen as wholly unacceptable to spend anything on the poor?
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Mighty Mouse
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by Mighty Mouse »

I have never said that the Republicans have the solution. My point is, why give any of them more money to waste and play with? I don't know about you, but I think we should be expecting and getting more than our current tax base is giving us in return from DC. They haven't shown that they can show fiscal restraint.

44 makes point about reducing the budget deficit with this bill. But that's because the additional revenue exceeds the additional outlays. Probably given all of the talk about reducing waste , fraud, ... that some of the additional revenue will come from reducing waste and greater efficiencies of scale. But some of the additional revenue comes from us. It may target the high end insurance premiums, but I view that as re-distributing wealth. I would be more for this if the targeting was across the board, obviously progressively. I don't think that's the job of the government to steal from one to give to another. It should be to benefit all.

It's great that people like 44 wants to help out in covering the uninsured, but why is the government and this specific bill the only solution? I'm a realist and realize that the bills are never as good as the proponents make it out to be and never as bad as the opponents characterization, but I am leery of a bill that required some heavy-handed tactics and subterfuge to pass.

BTW, defense/war is expressly the realm of Congress and the President. Health Care is not. It's not the job of the government to help the poor at the expense of another citizen.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by Rogue »

I'm thinking the partisan route is the only way to get things accomplished considering they've nothing to offer. Scaring up votes is a tired routine. The Right is an empty box with bomb written on the side.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by PGG »

Pardon my rudeness, I cannot abide useless people.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by Mighty Mouse »

Hypocrisy cuts both ways. I recall Democrats criticizing Bush policies and making their administration difficult. So in order to avoid hypocrisy, I guess your solution is that the minority party shut up and go along with the majority. Good idea. Only majority voice should be heard for fears of hypocrisy.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by PGG »

I wasn't saying that the dems didn't pull the exact same chit before. I will say though, that it has to stop sometime, and I'm tired of everybody saying "them first." The fact that this is becoming a much more tooted horn that it was four years ago also adds to the obnoxiousness of the entire situation. We who are leaning, or even on the democrat's side know all to well how spineless they can be. I'm tired of righties thinking their being abused and neglected, when really they're supporting the exact same actions that they complained during the Bush era.
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Re: Our president, not many threads about him.

Post by PGG »

:)

Makes me happy someone called me out on that. I find her obnoxious, but that's the only organized video that I could find that wasn't from some super liberal airhead pushing even more crap into it than she does. For instance, when she says republicans proposed and then opposed a pay as you go system, she doesn't mention that the republicans referred to a paygo system being used to right the wrongs that had been committed with bailout plan. When Obama started to say he was for a paygo system, republicans rightly criticized him, and said they refused to vote for it until they knew the government would be able to support the structure. Yes, a little backwards, but not nearly as much so as she makes it out to be.

However, when she mentions how Obama is for trying terror suspects in US courts, it is true that bush was too. But again, there were some (although not all) dems who opposed Bush on this. Do some digging on the other points she mentions. I learned a lot by just cross checking and disproving some of her facts.

SO, now we get into the opinions. I believe that, right now, republicans are blocking most progress in the government. The problem is, without their INPUT into the situation, no one is going to be happy with the outcome. They have to try to push INTO president obama, not push AWAY.
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